In part one we heard the story of Armand’s long road to success in the animation industry…
Now, the conversation with Armand gets spiritual as we discuss ‘pure creativity,’ the role of Armand’s faith in his career and creative process and how many aspiring artists are working backwards…
The conversation then spins around 180 degrees to focus on technique and workflow.
Of course, we also ask Armand about the closing of the Disney Florida Studio and his subsequent transition to Sony.
…and as long-time listeners of The ArtCast might expect, Chris cannot resist completely geeking-out about Surf’s Up.
Jose-Luis Segura joins me as a guest co-host.
Listen To Part 2 Of My Interview With Armand Serrano:
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Top 10 Essential Concept Art Books (Part 1)
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The Long Haul
In today’s fast-paced world we are led to believe that the journey to success is one that should happen quickly. However, as we saw today with Armand, the reality is that more often than not it is a slow process.
What do think of this disparity? How do you deal with the reality of the long haul?
Share and discuss your thoughts in the comments below!
I have to say, these interviews are amazing. Armand is a joy to listen to. He’s so thoughtful, kind, and knowledgeable. I’m really enjoying this series.
Question: are these the extended versions?
Jose, your work is incredible. That is all. 😀
“Learn to think and have ideas is more important than drawing….then use those drawing to convey the idea” – whoa…just whoa…That’s incredible.
Lilo and Stitch – I got all of Armand’s work for this movie. I love how he draws tropical plants. I want my forests and plants to be as cool as his one day; I’m just geeking out over his work. His plants look alive, they’re so good.
“Think inside and outside the box” – this is very refreshing to hear. There’s so much emphasis in thinking outside of the box, it’s nice to hear that thinking inside the box is also needed.
Lasso tool for vegetation – what is this magic? Is he using the lasso like the Animals in Hats magic box lesson…but for plants?
Positivity – hahaha! I felt the same way! I was like, “This guy is like a happiness machine.” But it’s a good point that he’s all about the people. Know thyself, and he’s mastered it, I think.
Fantastic stuff, just so good! This was the best thing for a Friday morning. Cheers!
The Reality of the Longhaul – Whenever I get down about that, I ask myself one question, “If you could do it all over again, and chose a different life, would you?” To date, I’ve never been able to say, “Yes, I would have chosen a different life.” so, since I would never go back and do it different, the only choice it to press on. 🙂
Found the extended version, please disregard that comment. 🙂
Awesome, yeah, everything for the Backstage Pass is at http://OatleyAcademy.com/backstage-pass/
So good! Great observations, Sarah.
To your question: Armand uses the Lasso for “rendering” like we do in The Magic Box “Fancy Animals” lessons. He also uses it for concepts like we do in The Magic Box “Creature Masks” lessons.
So cool! I’ll be checking that out. I see so many plants in my future. Thousands of plants….
Foliage. Foliage EVERYWHERE! 😀
What do I think about the long game? How do I deal with the long haul?
OATLEY ACADEMY!
It makes the long haul a lot more fun and hope-filled. If I didn’t have OA, I’d probably be in despair about the disparity. I would certainly never be where I’m at now, working on what I’m working on now. But it’s not just that, it’s the people I’ve met here and the relationships that have been forged in the firepit of awesome that is OA.
<3 <3 <3 It's not about the job. It's about the people. Love you guys. Great cast as always.
… I have more thoughts. I’ve been listening to Quitter on audible this week.
And while OA is my go-to happy place, there’s an even deeper, more gut-heart-ethereal-soul answer to this. It’s the why. Why do I do what I do every day? Why do I draw or write? Why am I here? What is my purpose?
I think, like Armand, for me, religion answers this. It keeps me from going insane. Answering these questions for myself and believing that there’s something that I can bring to the table. Something that I can contribute, some unknown-to-me-but-known-to-the-universe purpose that I am here to fill.
I don’t want to go too morbid or macabre, but if I were to die tomorrow, I’d be content knowing, even if I have all these projects that I left unfinished, that my husband knows I love him and that I was able to help people. I’m so grateful for the opportunity to do that here at OA. OA makes it easy to give people hope to achieve more than they believe is possible.
I find immense value in that. Armand brings up getting his family involved in what he’s doing. I really like that. I involve my husband in every story I write. How can I not? He’s SO good at bouncing ideas and writing and talking. It’s a core part of us and part of our spirit.
Okay. I have to stop or I’m gonna write a novel about this. It seems as if I just put my whole heart on the table.
So many thoughts. 🙂
Aww! *__*
This is so inspiring, Britny! And yeah, Chris is right. Your growth has been so amazing, it’s crazy! <3
Thanks, Britny! That’s suuuuuper-encouraging!!! And yes! Your growth over the past year alone is amazing!
Oatley Academy has also been my haven these long past few years. It’s been great to struggle along with you, Britny! Keep at it.
I love the Long Haul personally. First of all, it’s job security to know the longer I strive, the more valuable and unique I become. It also takes the pressure off my drive for greatness … I don’t have to be amazing tomorrow, I just need to have faith (looking back and forward) that special things will happen along the way as I just keep trekking!
I think one of the best ways to gain better perspective and enjoy the journey is to reach out and help other people. We learn things better when we “teach” them and service expands the soul!
This was an amazing episode! I gave me hope as I sat, working away.
Thanks!
Yeah Scott, me too!
There’s so much power on the long haul, right? Every time i feel myself getting discouraged I take a deep breathe and remember that. Helps everytime!
Your work has been a huge inspiration and motivation boost to me over this past year, so thank you tons for being amazing! 🙂
Thanks Ânia. YOU also inspire me. 🙂
I should share an experience this morning. Even though I work in animation, I spend at least an hour each morning working on personal projects.
This morning was glorious for how I felt creatively, not because my sketches are great (I’m in the “draw bad on purpose as I discover” phase) but because I felt like I made great discoveries and progress.
The Scott Wiser from a few years ago might have been discouraged and wrote this morning off as a waste, but anything I’ve successfully created is made of at least 100 such mornings!
Keep journeying Ânia! I can’t wait to see what you do!
Such a good point Scott! That perspective is so pivotal in our success as artists– viewing a bunch of less-than-ideal drawings as either time wasted, or time put toward new discoveries.
I also used to think that a drawing session was only worthwhile if the drawings looked good, and that led to me barely drawing at all because of this pressure to get it right. Now I view every bad drawing or concept as moving one step closer to the right one and I find myself much more productive.
Awesome episode! It was exactly what I needed to hear – perfect timing. I really loved how he talked about knowing what was IN the box before thinking outside of it. That’s so important. And I think that ties in with the discussion question you mentioned about slow success – because it takes a long time to find out what is in the box, and to master it, before you can begin to work outside the box with any kind of relevance.
I also thought his ideas on gathering reference materials was super timely! With pinterest, and google and everything online, I often find myself with ridiculous pinterest boards that are really not that helpful!! It’s so great to hear that we can trust our instincts and weed out the most useful materials based on our reactions to them.
Thanks so much!!
Crystal
Yes! The voice of experience!
Hey Chris and Jose,
Amazng finish to the interview. The whole time I was listening to the show I was saying to myself, “man, I wish I was as positive and personable as him. ” as someone in their early twenties I feel like a lot of things are in progress. I am trying to start a family, trying to start a life with integrity, trying to develop my art, my core beliefs and philosophies and then just trying to stay alive in general. Often connecting with other people doesn’t make my list of priorities. I have constantly been reminding myself to fix that. But it is hard, & I think that Armands level of positivity and connection is present because it really is genuine. Some of us have to try hard to be that positive. Well I think we should all be true to ourselves I think we should also assimilate the qualities of others as best we can and Armand is a shining example of somebody to learn from. Oh and his art is incredible
Awesome interview! Armand is so genuine and an amazing artist, and I really appreciate his humbleness about his work and journey as an artist. Also yay Jose! 😀 Awesome to hear you on the artcast!
I still struggle sometimes with the long-haul. I know that becoming a successful artist isn’t an overnight thing. It’s more that progress is so gradual and often hard to quantify that I sometimes worry if I’m making the best choices to advance my skills and my relationships. I think I’ve made great strides in the last year alone (thanks to you wonderful OA folks), but I’m always asking myself how I can do more.
One thing I can say, is that I was uncertain about my comic for the first year I was posting– it was very slow to start and I was wondering if anyone was even looking at it. But having just started posting the next chapter, I’ve seen a noticeable growth in interest. So the long haul is beginning to pay off, and it helps me to keep going. 😀
I agree with Britny about purpose. When you know you have a purpose as we all do, your heart tells you to keep going even though you might be struggling. Armand’s decision to put God and his family first shows a person of great character. I am encouraged by the leaps he took moving from place to place but thinking about the whole picture of the people around him. It must have taken a lot of courage but he was not trying to make decisions on his own.
Armand was talking about sometimes you have to think inside of the box.
A way to think inside the box is “The Magic Box.” “The Magic Box,” is teaching me to take some needed steps before just diving into my artwork. I struggle with jumping on a creative quest too often without any reference, comps or really thinking about my course of action. Its my outside of the box thinking that sometimes makes me feel lost but having great artists in the centrifuge helping me along the way.
Thanks Chris, Jose and Armand for bringing me inspiration today!
I really loved listening to both these interviews! Armand has such a positive spirit. It was really encouraging to hear him share how he balances everything in his life; his faith, his family, his art, and career. So inspiring! ^_^
As for the Long Haul question, I think it gets the most discouraging when I get too caught up in where I wish I was or where I feel I “should” be, rather than where I am now. A lot of what Brittany said resonated with me. My faith helps me refocus on the bigger picture and reminds me that I have been given a role to play in this world. From that bigger picture, I can move into the present and look at what I can do now and who I can be here for. Finding joy in my artistic journey and learning how to be content with where I am, while continuing to learn and grow is also helpful. (Although I’m not as good at this as I should be. :-/)
Thanks again, Chris, Armand, and Jose! ^_^
You’re so welcome, Bethany! And I’m happy to hear that the interview was helpful.
You’re right – “should” can really get us into trouble!
Wow. Such a great interview with Armand. Very inspiring story and great to hear some of his ideas and process. Thanks again for an amazing interview!
Very good interview . Amazing artist, creative with a beautiful style .
I loved the ideas of knowing what’s inside the box before you try thinking outside it and break the rules not the law. And the dynamic reference research will definitly help refine the process. So much great insight and information.
Knowing your own priorities and being at ease with yourself can help everyone in todays world of have to have it instantly. I think part of the reason people think they have to be successful right away is that attention spans become shorter and shorter so to feel successful people think thwt has to come faster and sooner.
Were all life long learners but sometimes it’s hard to realize that in ones youth.
Thank you for always having such inspirational podcasts! I always enjoy listening to these interviews, and listening to them makes me remember that a lot of the artists I admire were once in my situation as well (and I can get to where I want to be, as long as I keep working at it)!
Concerning the long haul, I think staying optimistic is what keeps me going. That, and having amazing people who support and encourage me, because their belief in my ability really pushes me to keep at what I do. I also feel that the long haul makes the end result more worthwhile, because of all the amount of work it takes to get there, and knowing that makes it an amazing accomplishment.
Chris I loved part 2! Oh my gosh when Armand talked about thinking about design to be in the shape of a pyramid with the bottom being the idea or story, the middle the design, and the top the technique, it was awesome advice! As soon as he explained this I immediately felt it made total sense.
Listening to Armand talk about the importance of first developing your idea which turns into the type of story you want to make was really an eye opener for me, as I want to illustrate children’s books. But haven’t really put thought into fine turning any kind of idea to turn into a story and instead just focused on the drawing side. Which now I know isn’t the right approach.
And then it was interesting when he spoke about the designing stage and how in order to be successful here a good designer builds upon the solid ideas of their story so they can effectively illustrate some believable and pleasing designs to give themselves and the viewer visual examples of the main underlying idea of the story they’re trying to create. So good!
As soon as Armand said that young artists always make the mistake of looking at the pyramid inverted and start with technique first instead of the idea and story I couldn’t help but sheepishly raise my hand, yup that sounds like me! I get so wrapped up in making my art look pretty or amazing and don’t really put any thought into it. When Armand said that he teaches his student to think before they can draw it reminded me of how you too Chris stress the importance of this and made me again realize how I need to remember this and not forget it in favor of just creating something.
I liked hearing how he talked about his faith in God made him who he is and also how he does his art because of his values starting with God and then his family and finally his job. That was inspiring to hear how his loving and open relationship with God and love for his family helped him work and draw faster and smoother. I agree that when you have an open relationship with God like he does that everything falls into place. I believe because God is the one who inspires us with the ideas we turn into art and stories that thinking and feeling like Armand is good for the soul and helps an artist keep their values and priorities straight and also feel at peace like he mentioned too.
Thinking inside the box before outside of the box makes so much sense, especially as Armand put it, when you learn the rules first and then once you’ve mastered them only then can you break the rules and make up your own stuff. When researching for image references I struggle to find images I connect with and that have some element to it that I’m looking for to incorporate into my own art. So when Armand mentioned using a dynamic research approach I felt encouraged that maybe using this method can help me. Great interview Chris! And hearing Jose-Luis Segura’s observations was interesting too. 🙂
As for your question concerning the long haul, I’m an artist who works slowly so I’m not surprised that achieving artistic success takes time. Sure I’ve read of stories of some artists getting successful faster than others, but I take note of things that those particular artists did like they produced new art at a steadier pace than me and promoted their art in such a way that it drew attention immediately. So how I’d deal with the long haul is that like Armand, I would try to keep a positive attitude and be grateful for the support I get from my family and others I’d meet along with trying to take advantage of opportunities as much as I can to promote myself and make others aware of my art.
So much good stuff in this interview. I loved his comment about an art piece needing a three-part pyramid structure. Mastering visual art IS intimidating, and it helps me to break it down into those components. Also ‘dynamic research’. I had a page of Google images open in front of me when I heard that part. I’m going to try to put it into practice.
One thing that helps me in the long haul is seeing the value in work I’m doing right now. If I create something beautiful & meaningful and put that out into the world, that has value. Even if my career doesn’t go further in that direction or I realize I want to do something different, I’ll have made something of value. That helps me pull my focus in and do the work.
Concerning the disparity of fast-paced success vs. the a slow burn, I’ve learned first-hand that it’s necessary to fall in love with the process and take each day at a time. When I graduated college I thought I would find a job right of the bat. I was admittedly naive, and it took me two years to realize the level of time and commitment it takes to be a successful artist. I’ll be relocating to Southern California in two weeks, and with a more mature mindset, I believe that this is the true beginning of my journey at age 24. I had to learn to not be discouraged by the younger artists who have success and a large fanbase, and I had to learn to not compare myself to successful artists because they have put levels of time and effort that I have not yet. Finally, I realized that you will find your path if you stay persistent. I discovered this podcast two weeks ago and I am now a complete fan, and will be signing up for the Backstage Pass very soon.